Cliff Vmir On Being A Hair Stylist At A Young Age, Starting His Music Career, + More | Jay Hill #20

Sir we're gon na pop bottles in this [ __ ] cliff, is here. What'S popping y'all um, you said you got serious research reward, though you said you nervous yeah. I got a little lipo, i'm getting so in a dr break that down from what the [ __ ] is that lipo was like in your stomach. Like you know they they suction the fat out um i lost in the last year. I lost about like 60 to 70 pounds, so i probably am gon na have to do like a little mini tummy tuck, because you know when you lose a lot of weight, you get like a little extra skin um. That'S all about what i'm doing, though. So you lost the weight like um organically. How was that it was a big lifestyle - change um. Well, i didn't. I didn't really do it by myself. I did do something um like what talk to me come on. So a lot of people don't know. This is like the first time i'm talking about this. Thank you, but i did. I did do something called a vsg surgery, and that is basically where they cut your stomach in half. Okay, so, like i can't eat like i'm, not really supposed to eat over two ounces um, and i got it done in september, and i went from being 253 pounds to now 170. I'M like 175 pounds. Now. Congratulations. Thank you. I mean so either way you get it done. Um yeah! I got it done. What'S the name of the surgery, vsg vsg yeah? What type of like is that um? It'S like a gastric surgery, almost um - i don't know it just. I know i can't eat like that: yeah i'll, google, it you say you can't eat more than two ounces yeah like i have like. Literally. If i go to mcdonald's and i order like some chicken nuggets, i could probably eat one chicken nugget and maybe like two or three french fries and then in like two or three hours, i'm back hungry. How was the it's terrible? I'M not gon na lie like, and i'm glad that i kind of waited to tell on this podcast, but a lot of my followers is like no. I ain't gon na lie before i did do the vsg. I was doing some diet pills by dream body studio and they really did help, but i noticed like once i was able things once i was able to kind of start back eating and, like i started pigging out, it's like the weight would come back. It would double it would just always double up, and i i just feel like when it came to food. I never could really control myself, so the vsg basically has helped me maintain it. It'S helped me just you know, and i feel a lot better. Like imagine. Just like going to different stores, you know louis vuitton, christian dior, you know you want to get into some jeans or some you know just all different types of clothes and you can't fit them when they're stuck now yeah. So now now i'm i'm academic. So the thing is, though, cause it's like you know: [ __ ] in atlanta, you from up north mm-hmm. I from i know if [ __ ] like to eat - and i mean you can't eat that much right now like right, but you say it's worth it because it's definitely worth it and i know how to cook really good. So it's like it's. I ain't gon na lie. It'S like a mental thing like especially like, while i'm cooking, i'm like damn like i'm cooking food for my boyfriend or my friends, i'm like damn. I know this [ __ ] is about to be good. Then i eat one bite now. I'M full it's it's a mental thing, but i feel like. Ultimately, i would rather be slim than to enjoy food and just get bigger and bigger. I really feel like i had an eating yeah i feel like i had an eating disorder like i just always was hungry. I think that's everybody like what, like everybody loves, especially in atlanta. They got so much good food places to go like it was different like every every maybe couple hours i was going to cook out mcdonald's, burger king and i'm like yeah, and it was terrible. It was. It was terrible. I'M judging you! That'S disgusting yeah. It was very disgusting and then, like i, didn't, want to work out, um and then like when i started getting big. I started to really like i started trying to wear stuff to hide it like bigger shirts, um. You know just stuff to kind of camouflage it, but you can always tell all in my face so vsg has helped me. I don't feel bad man a lot, so i started wearing biggest shirts because of that i'm dead. I'M gon na keep it on it. How can we be honest, like i'm talking, i'm judging you [ __ ], i do the same [ __ ] like when i was younger. I was fit like a [ __ ] yeah. Now i be grabbing out and i don't work out that much right and i'm like nah. I need my shirt like yeah and you know the older you get, the more the weight sticks on wax and it's harder to get it's harder to get rid of it. [ __ ], these [ __ ] [ __ ] got ta, get it done yeah, so you from jersey, mm-hmm, right, um, you're, doing this music thing and we're gon na go all over the place cause. I just wan na we wan na talk about music, we're gon na talk about a lot of other things right. How much of you would say your style, your music, your music style, is influenced by jersey. So first my motto is gorgeous gangsta right and that's my motto because i feel like up north. We are like natural gangsters like we are very hard, we're very aggressive. We'Re very, like you know, straight to the point whether like down south they're, very like well, i'm not gon na lie because they definitely are ruthless out here as well, but they have more of a southern hospitality. So and i feel like my dad, i get the whole gorgeous ginseng thing from my dad, because back in the day, my dad was like one of the biggest drug dealers. He is still to this day, like a og, like he's really like into the streets very actively um, so um. I just feel like from me being raised around that, like that jersey, hardcore type of like environment um, i just feel like it rubbed off on me. Like i'm, really not the typical gay boy like like a lot of [ __ ], doesn't bother me, i'm really straightforward. I'M very blunt like i don't you know how like when people feel like, oh well, how do you feel about little boozy like i don't care? Little boosie is not talking to me he's not talking about me. I don't care, you know, so i felt like that whole just up north. I feel like we we kind of have to it's like we have to be kind of like blunt and straightforward. You can't be sensitive and it's we don't mean no harm. Even when you come here, i'm like [, __, ] man, i'm saying all type of yeah, but it's like i'm not talking like i'm. Not just you know you can feel the love. That means yeah right. So um, i definitely would say that. But what about the music, though, like because you know this is the biggest long debate that i'm pretty sure you know about this baltimore club, jersey club who started first, but even in that and even in that aspect i see a lot of like artists coming from Baltimore trying to incorporate that music into into the club sound, are you influenced by any club, music or anything, i'm not really influenced by the club scene? I do know back in the day like i used to do like the whole baltimore club, music, the wu tang and the you know the sexy, walking and all that. But you know, as you get older, you don't really do that type of [ __ ]. No! More, but one thing i will say is when i do hear that music, sometimes i do make you want to dance, but as far as incorporating in my music, not really um, it's just more sort of mentality is what i incorporate in the music. It'S crazy because um you say that, and i kind of like knew that, because i listened to a couple: songs and you've been doing this for a minute. Rapping uh well just being lit yeah in general, like i feel like you, like you crawled for a lot of people to walk yeah and i'm glad you said i want to know so so, and this is why i say bear with me and sit up to The audience i need y'all baby because we don't talk about music, but it's so it don't start there right. It doesn't and i'm sorry i'm saying it's like it's hard to be like. I can't force that i want you, but i can't yeah. Let'S talk about this. First, okay um: the first thing that popped out to me. When so somebody sent you the rap on amp shout out to them they from the dmv too, like you should you should interview uh him because uh it would be controversial or some [ __ ] like that right and i read the caption and it kept saying, Like using the pronoun him - and i see a lot of people do not even see you do that, and i was like i didn't understand, because usually i would think you would want to be a girl called by a girl like talk to me. So, okay, i'm glad we're doing this podcast because i feel, like you know, over the years, a lot about me has changed like you know, back in 2019, i had a show with bet, and i made this big statement i was like you know. I don't want to be a girl, i'm a guy. You know blah blah blah. So for the record i feel like in two - and this is just my opinion and two i come out with breast or until i say, hey, i'm doing hormones. I'M now trying to become a woman or you know, because i really don't know if this is a phase like i really don't know. I may end up going back to wearing a mohawk, which i feel 100 000. I never will, but when you're, young and you're learning yourself and you're, just like you know, because you got to remember like this - really isn't normal, it's not normal for a guy to wear, hair and makeup, and you know i'm not on no hormones. I'M not. You know getting brass like yeah, i might have a feminine body, it's so weird, but i feel like i don't want to label myself. I just want to be he you yeah. I want to be who i am, and i just feel like. I'M cliff you know until i say otherwise, then we gon na roll with that. But as of right now it's cliff. Is he and that's just all it's and i say that popped out to me because, like you know, as a journalist or somebody i do conduct interviews, i try to be respectful as possible so like when i see it, you know, i know what happens. Is somebody come out gay or say they're trying to or they want to be referred by? She is in the world. What happens? Is they just they're, so ignorant yeah that they want to call you a guy, because they know right, and i didn't know if that was it, and people were just intentionally not saying it, but then i started doing more research and i'm like oh no. This is what you should go about. I was just wondering wow um. Another thing that i saw was uh you. You mentioned your pops earlier, whatever he was like, he was real big in the streets. You wasn't accepted by your pops yeah in the beginning. I wasn't in the oh, so when did that change um, i feel like it. It really and i'm not gon na lie. I feel like it took the world to support me, and you know i feel like where i'm from in jersey is penns grove and it's like a very, very small town. We don't really have. We don't have no celebrities there. It'S like a town of like poverty. There'S nobody there. That'S like me, i mean there is but and not even physically, i'm talking more like star yeah, like you know, and you have to remember like when you have somebody and take away their sexuality. When you have somebody who is so talented, i'm not even talking about musically, because i feel like musically. I haven't even already tapped in yet, but i feel like when it came down to being a hair stylist. And you have somebody who is so young and so talented and know what they want out of life. I feel, like you, have no other option but to respect it and i feel like it took my father to see that within me, like it like wow. My son is really out here doing some big things and he's only 18. wow. You know so after a while i feel like and then i'm grown you know so i feel like after a while. He began to respect it. Like i, you know. Uh last year was my first time being around my father wearing hair makeup. You know i have like a big butt. I have this body and i'm so nervous. I'M like, oh, my god. I don't know what my but he was so respectful like he didn't make me feel uncomfortable and i feel like that's. The biggest thing is just making sure that as a father or a parent, your child is comfortable. You know it's to the point where, like my boyfriend is also super thorough, like i don't even really like guys who act feminine and gaffe like there should be one me personally, i feel like there should be one feminine and one masculine. My boyfriend is super masculine. He'S into like guns and dirt bikes he's like really and my dad and him they click like this, like my dad calls him on his own, you know so i just feel like it's a respect thing and i feel like once, people get the whole gay. The all that, out of their minds, they'll, understand that, like literally being a gay person like you're human you're you're, like i like, i believe, yeah like i fight how you fight you know what i'm saying like it literally happened, but i mean you fight like how I fight, but if i get my eyes out by you or straight man, get it it's bad yeah! No, but it's happened so many times like people. A lot of men feel like. Oh, he wear wig. Oh he likes men. He can't fight. This is what they feel they feel like this and a lot of men. Like i remember one time it's been a couple times like i've had to get with some of my friends, boyfriends and [ __ ], like i just don't play disrespect, i don't care who you are like, i'm probably like no shade, i'm probably more gangster than you Are like meaning like i like i'm in traffic, arguing with people i'll pull my gun, and i have to stop doing that. But i i will that's just how i am you know, but yeah you know so so it's just like. I just feel like when it comes down to respecting, i feel, like that's deserved, i feel like respect. Any respect is due to a dog anybody, and i i just love the fact that now my father respects it and he's appreciates it. I mean he's accepting to it, so i always try to play like devil's advocate or the other side of the gate. Right, um - and you know, and preparing for this interview i i tried to like you know, just look at a lot of other people's styles right and i was watching the um dwyane wade interview with uh. I am athlete because he did an interview talking about his son, who they call their daughter now, because that's what she want to be called right and the things he was saying on the interview was basically like you know. I guess she was watching something. Somebody was gay or whatever and he was putting him out and he was put him out because he was gay, saying what i think. Uh sausage santana had a similar situation where his mother was like um start, throwing all his clothes away and stuff like that because like if you're gon na be wrong, you can't be grown under my roof right. It'S weird because that's an experience that i experienced with my parents, like my mama's, always like i'ma love you, but if you ever be gay, you never wan na stay under my roof. So, as i became an adult i used to always say you know, i don't have a problem with gay people or people that um call themselves gay, but if my child was gay i would love them, but they just couldn't live with me because that's all i Saw right, i say that to say full circle: um, maybe your father just didn't know how to accept it because of the generation, but for him, maybe he didn't come accepting you because of the world except you maybe just didn't know how to and and i'm not Going to lie, like i remember growing up - and i remember hearing him on him and my mom have a conversation, and i remember like this: is you know every child around the age of 14? 15 16? They start developing a mouth and they start getting into this mentality like where they can beat the world and ain't. Nobody going to talk to them crazy and i remember i used to have like little mannequins and i'll be knocked out with mannequins and i would hide them under my bed and every week when i got an allowance, i would go on amazon and i would order These mannequins and it just seemed like every month, while i'm at school. Why is my dad doing a deep clean in my room and why is he going under my bed and throwing my mannequins away? And i remember one day i came home and i did these fire ass braids on this mannequin and i noticed the mannequin wasn't under the bed. No more! Oh! Well. All hell broke looses at this point like that was a masterpiece i created and you threw it away, and i remember me and him got into - and i remember him going in the room and telling my mom i'm not raising no [ __ ]. If i wanted to have a girl, i would have had a girl, but i also have three sisters, so it's just like i don't know, i just feel like people don't really think like and i'm not gon na lie. I feel like i was born this way. Like i don't feel like, this is something that somebody can make you or you know, as a child. I seen like. I never was a child that got touched or anything or around people like that. I just knew when i came out the wounded like i knew. What i wanted not not like that meaning, like i know i didn't, i wasn't attracted to no girl. You know as a as a child as a um infant growing up as a child. I looked at girls and women as barbie dolls. I looked at them like i wanted to play in my hair, which i call it music. Is that what it's called i mean? I'M i'm amused as like a model: oh okay, yeah, but i looked at them like something yeah like i did like. I used to go up the girls and just like play in their hair and stuff, and i remember, like you know whether, if it was my sister's or my like grandma's friends yeah, but like you gon na, be my boyfriend and i'll be looking at them. Like you too big, like you know, knowing deep down inside hell, no hell, no ain't gon na be a boyfriend. Wait. So did you ever have a experience with a girl? I kissed the girl, that's it that's it. So i say all this to say: um we was talking about how like before we was like you had to cross. So so many people can walk you always knowing this right, um and just acting around you was lit at a young age. Like i mean kind of how it would be the equivalent - and i ain't trying to do this, but i'm sorry it would be the equivalent of how, like our superstars, had to grow up like biowow right. I'M saying little romeo and i say these people because it was like once they became adults. We wasn't able to accept them because we we kept the only children as far as your business right. Do you feel, like you, was at a disadvantage being lit so early. No, so you think you still get the same respect of course, and i'm not settling for nothing underneath. So when i say respect, i mean people, do you think people still look at you the same way? They was looking how you when you were 17.. I i don't think so. That'S why i say this because you know i stopped doing hair in 2017 and a lot of people are like. Oh cliff fell off, oh he, no! Just because, like you should be happy that i was in a position to be able to say, i'm not doing here, no more, i'm not taking no more clients, i'm moving on to something else, and i did that because you have to remember, i toured all across The world with different artists, i taught classes all around the world, i did clients in every single city. I literally was doing all of this stuff. When i was 16., i was 16 years old in high school having a full roster of celebrity clients, and i had a talent that was undeniable. Once you get to a certain point, when you're running laps around people, it is not fun, no more. It'S super boring and it's like i was bored and i like to be uncomfortable. I like to have like something to work towards. You know what i'm saying, and i feel like. Music was like the next thing in my opinion, because i knew nothing about it um. I knew how to rhyme. I knew how to sometimes i'm a really good writer i feel like i can speak very well, but when it came down to music i felt like that was an industry that i really always was interested in and i wanted to be uncomfortable. So do you ever look back and say damn man i wish i would have went about it another way because you still can now, because if, if i want to get back in this hair game right now, today like if i left here instead, i'm gon na Wrap and i'm gon na do hair. It will be over for everybody. So let me ask you why, because i feel like - and you could take, because i'm a stranger and what i mean by that i didn't know nothing about, like you know like the hair, how lit you was like i'm a completely stranger all this is from research That i've done and from when i, when i'm asking right, i got one, i'm glad you said it first because, like i guess, one person was like cliff was like a superstar young like way before everybody for real. But, like i don't know, he just fell off or whatever, and i'm like i by you saying it. I know it you hear it, you know you don't never like. That'Ll, never hurt your feelings. You never think about like damn what, if um it does sometimes, but i'm not gon na lie like i have a bigger vision for myself and right now, i'm kind of like reinventing myself a little bit um, that's like if nicki minaj was to say today, like Oh, i'm not gon na rap, no more, i'm gon na be a doctor. Of course people are gon na say she fell off because they're used to her for one thing and that's music. However, right now i'm doing my groundwork and i'm trying to implant it in people's hands. Like listen, i'm going to be an artist now i don't care how you feel i'm going to be an artist and eventually i know because anything i say i'm going to do. I do it like, i remember, being 16 standing in front of my cosmetology class and telling them i'm going to be a big celebrity, hair, stylist and everybody laughed. Everybody was like boy go ahead whatever and look what happened i remember seeing i was gon na. Have my own tv show everybody? Okay, whatever cliff boom boom? What happened b-e-t, so music is not an overnight thing. You know, and you have to stay down until you come up and when my come-up comes, it's just going to be like a win-win, because people already know me for hair back in the day. Now it's just going to amplify it. So you want to talk about music. I know that right mm-hmm. So, let's, let's have a real conversation. Okay, you've been doing you ain't just starting music yeah like it's 2018, i mean that's not yes, that's not just yesterday, though, but i feel like i haven't fully like tapped into it. Yet so you're telling me you want me as a consumer right mm-hmm and i'm glad we set the stage. So you know we just we just rapping if i'm a consumer right - and i want to you - want me to take your music seriously, what you've been wrapping for 2018. How many, how many projects you put out, i haven't, put out a project, yet you ain't put out a project yet how many uh! So if we look, if we look on um itunes, i think you dropped one song just recently right in like um april mm-hmm. The rest of it is like 2021. mm-hmm, but you're telling me you want me to take you seriously as an artist. How? Because i feel like i have talent and when it comes - and i know this is something i'm working with as far as being consistent and shout out to my new team that i just got shout out to the game. Yes, however, i feel like a lot of it, lacked within me having so many things going on, because outside of being an artist, i am i'm an entrepreneur. I have a business, i have a lifestyle to maintain, so i i don't have nobody putting money behind me. I don't have you know a lot of these artists who are getting signed. Who you know are staff. They have somebody who is putting money behind them. I have rent to pay. I have a car note. That'S the [ __ ] price of my rent. I have employees to pay like i have so much. I have going on so music doesn't pay me and i have to do what pays me and then do my music. But, however, i feel like this is going to be the year and remember this is going to be the year that i'm going to be super consistent and i'm just going to so it was a time where he was doing here and guess how many days of The week he was going ahead, you know every [ __ ] day. Yes, everybody i mean my bad now you're girl you can pass. This is good, you don't have every single day and you became cliff, but wait don't get it construed, i'm in the studio at least three or four times a week. Okay, i just don't put it out, but that don't that's what i'm saying. That'S what i'm trying to tell you i i can care less about you being in this right. No, no! But guess what i feel like as an artist like - and this is another thing right like let's not act like i was i i started rapping in 2018 - and i just like was like okay single here single there. I don't wan na. No, i as an artist. I have you have to study your craft. I, like every day for months, i write i watched um. What was it with big ticket on bbc uh big ticket in the basement, the rap city yeah? Oh my god. I studied that because i wanted to improve my bars. I did artist development for literally like two years straight, so as an artist - and this is where a lot of artists getting misunscrewed, they they come out with a song and it might go viral, but they have no star power. They know nothing about hip hop. You know they know nothing about the history. They don't like. I study people like foxy brown, little kim. I study their era. I study how like they, they act in a videos like their demeanor. All of that stuff matters as an artist, and i feel, like you know, once i'm ready, which i'm ready now, but for a while i felt like i wasn't ready. I felt like there was a lot more. I felt like i wanted to know about music because it's not like hair. I went to school for hair, i'm teaching myself every as far as rhyming. As far as like punch lines - metaphor i'm doing this myself. So it's like. I have to take time myself and really understand it and really get down to the get down before i really just start, throwing. How do you think the feedback is so far for me? I feel, like you know the last couple like the last 2021 and 2022 they're [ __ ] with it they [ __ ] with it yeah. I say that because when i listen to the music you know it's so easy to be judgmental right, like it's um, it's easy to judge a book box cover. When i listen to it, i actually think you can rap, but i was curious to ask you this. Like do you think, that's the do you think that's part of the problem because, like you hear these music, because you aren't the only one that's doing this like, of course we got saucy santana um. I don't know if roland raymond - i don't know, there's so many people up in the lgbtq community - that's making music. So we can't. We can't really let the head that be a crush now, because it's 20 22 at this point right. But when you hear the music that santana is making right, it's like it's all about. It'S like it's really. Speaking from the girl perspective, like twerking and walking all that - and you are speaking from a girl perspective, but you're really rapping, though like you're rapping, and it can, i don't know like. I just really think it's my consistency. I really do. Okay, this year, y'all gon na see me be so consistent like this. I'M gon na make sure that the remainder of the year i'm gon na. I just really feel like it's my consistency i feel like as long as i can stay consistent and not even with being consistent, because i'm not going to lie for a while. I didn't have a team i didn't have no like. I didn't have people behind me like even on days that i woke up and said you know what i don't want to be: a [ __, ], rapper. No, more guess what you i got! Ta motivate myself! I don't have nobody behind me. Like cliff ain't, no quitting ain't, no like no or when i got ta like cuz. I not only am i paying my bills, i'm paying my mom's bills, i'm paying my grandma. So you know i have [ __ ]. I like i'm, i'm working towards like it's. Not just a one-man, you know it's not like someone. A label just signed me and i got millions. No, i have to work for what i want and if the money isn't rolling in, like i care about my like no shade, i care about my money. More than i care about somebody taking me serious with music, i used to now i'll go broke for the music. You know because i feel like it's not like. All you have to do is be consistent and i feel like that's my problem. Do you feel like you, you need like one of those party songs. You feel like pressure from that, because i feel like the music i hear is not party from you. Like i'm hearing red. I just feel like i'm still kind of figuring out my sound. I don't know if i want to go more pop. I don't know if i want to go more like trap i like, but me personally, i feel like with how i rap and how rough i am. I don't really feel like that's my style yeah. I mean i don't think so, but that's why, but it could be like my manager can tell you. She says that i in the past, i've dropped all the wrong songs like if you listen to my catalogue of music. Like the other day, we sat down and we were basically like you'll, be like okay and i feel like the stuff i try to put out is like twerky and that's not me. I like i mean it's me. That'S i like that music, but that's not my sound. That'S not what's going to gravitate to people like that's what you did with uh saucy santana yeah like that's, not my sound you could tell, but i i feel like i did it because i'm like i got santana on the track like let's like. Do it big? You know, but i mean i i did the best i could [ __ ]. It'S all good. I feel like when people don't understand, let's not get [ __ ] up, let's not get [ __ ] up. I understand and i empathize with like you - take your parents like if you, if, god forbid, if it stopped today, you're a legend like you, did a lot of [ __ ], let's not get it like. I only want to seem like i'm coming off saying any other thing. You know what i'm saying, but i'm just speaking of towards the creative art of it people you know how they say. So what you going through, that right keep working, i'm trying to say. That'S all i'm speaking towards my um speaking about this like so it's like you got to re, reinvent yourself, mm-hmm, going back to the hair. Do you feel like when you, when you made the change of like because you was dressing like a boy at once, like he was cliff guy mohawk things like that, and then you was like no, i want to do this. Did you you even you didn't really prepare your audience for that? Do you think i don't feel like i need to you ain't need to, but do you think that impacted the people that supported you? No, you don't think so. I i mean i feel like we had like no shade to women. I love women, but i feel, like you have some women who are just like: they see a boy. The boy has hair and makeup on his his glam is together. He'S dressing good, you know they might feel like their man. Might like look at me. You know, or something and they're instantly, like hey, okay, you know, and i feel like a lot of my followers was like that. A lot of my women were like that, but like when people like actually get to meet me, i'm so sweet. I don't be on that type time, i'm very uplifting, but i just say that to say this like and remember this interview. Anybody, that's watching. Remember this interview: this is going to be the year that y'all see a lot of changes within me and my brand just me as, like a total powerhouse name like not only do i want to be an artist, but i want to have like big brand deals With like mac and maybelline - and you know, i just want to really - and i want to tap into my community like i want to really because you know my community is very we're very misunderstood. You know what i'm saying i feel like like like me, and you were just talking about how you was like. Oh you know like i don't know i didn't know if you wanted to be like a girl. You know a lot of us are very misunderstood. So i just want to be like that voice for my community, but i also want to be musically where i want to be, and i commend that and what i'm saying like when i hear you speak, i feel like it's almost like. How can i put like yeah two down the earth right because i feel like when i'm listening to you, you sound like me, but in all respect like you're, not me like you're, like the goat and what you doing i'm dope at what i don't get [ __ ] up, but right, i'm just giving you respect right and i it sounds like you want an understanding from people. I don't why not [ __ ] them, but yeah like when i'm hearing you right when i'm hearing you just it's like well, i ain't gon na lie, though, because when i used to be a hair stylist, i used to be a snob. I'M i used to be a [ __, ] snob, and this is me at a young age just feeling myself like and i'm not gon na lie. I feel like i turned a lot of people off like people and and not even being a snob but like if i see somebody at the hair show and they're like cliff they're coming up to me. They'Re crying and they're, like oh, my god right and i'm like hey yeah, okay, get it away from me. Okay, you know, but it just was because i was so young. I wasn't used to that right, but now i just feel like the best way to do things is to stay. Humble be a humble beast and that's what i want to be a humble beast, like i don't care how far i go, i want to maintain and be the same, humble genuine, hearted person that i always have been right and i don't ever want to change it. I want to get back to the switch right when i say to switch the switch from like cliff the guy that we see to cliff with the dressing like a girl makeup and things like that right. I and you say you, don't think that it corporate by surprise or, like you think here i mean it was it was a slow transition. It was like. I was wearing the hair one minute, then i would go back to the mohawk like it was like. I would put my foot in and then take it out. It was one for that. One yeah then like after a while, i just said [ __ ] it yeah yeah. No, i i was asking that because, like we keep saying this, [ __ ] round might be the title of the interview you got to cross over. So many people can walk and i feel like when you made that transition and mike was uncomfortable for your audience and they didn't know how to take it, because one thing about humans is like we hate different right. I feel like you was probably one of the first to do that and then you were so lit and it's like what the [ __ ] yeah, but now anybody can do it now and it's like they praise him yeah. Do you ever think? Do you have a look at your peers and be like damn like these [ __ ] got lucky, because i wasn't so lucky when i no cause, i don't. I i feel like. What'S meant for me is meant for me was meant for anybody else. It'S meant for them like that's, like nikki, nikki has crawled, so so many can run same thing with me. If you know you know, if you don't you, don't it's not my responsibility to school, you on what i've done, how i've impacted this industry? It'S not my response, like you know what i'm saying, i feel like the people who know they know the people who don't you'll just still try to figure it out. I say that because we all human, though so yeah moments when we in the housing, like you, get frustrated and that's really what i want to talk to, because i, when i talk to people, i always try to dig deeper in into those conversations like. How do you feel when nobody around you when you're in a room by yourself, i feel good as [ __ ]? Okay, i lost all this weight like what i'm what i i i get money every day. This is true. I ain't counting nobody else's pockets. You know i feel good, but you are trying to reinvent yourself. I am again, i think right so wait. You feel like cause, i'm trying to reinvent myself. Do you feel like i'm like depressed or something [, __ ]? No, i don't. I don't know like no. Like i shouldn't be depressed about, i just can i'm trying to imagine being super lit in something right and then trying to reach for a different goal, kind of like kanye, west right, kanye west is kanye west and making beasts right. That'S why i would never. I would never like uh doubt you, because i've seen it kanye's, one of my favorite people right so, like i say, like kanye west, is a superstar making beats right, but he was like i wan na rap and [ __. ] ain't take them serious and i'm trying to pick your mind to understand like how do you feel of like being so dope in some some areas and you trying to show people trying to prove people like. I can rap i'm a rap, i'm a rapper. Take me serious, but it's like it's taking time. I guess it's, not it's not the same cliff that was doing hair right. That'S why i'm trying to understand how you feel about that, like when you're in a house - and you see these people, your peers, that that has similar roasts to you. You know what i'm saying and like i i see it and i'm just doing it. Uh two hours of research, so i'm not gon na lie like and i feel like. I don't know if it's this barely like be real right. A lot. A lot of people know i feel, like a lot of people have had platforms. I feel like um, whether if it's been like a tv show whether if it's been like a you know, people like that are lit that they hang around. I feel like i've, always grinded on my own, i'm, like literally self-made. Nobody can say they made me. Nobody can say, like, oh, i put clip like literally cliff, put cliff on [ __ ]. So i don't even remember what you just asked me. I think i understand what you're saying though, so sometimes people might get um endorsements, but wait this. This is why i would never be upset, never be sad right if music doesn't work out. I swear to god. I can make a post right now, while we in this office - and i could say back taking appointments, do you know how much money i would get? I believe you like do you know like now. I wouldn't be um washed up or whatever they be saying you know now. I would be back to go. Oh, my god, so i'm not worried about anything because they're going to fall on a bandwagon eventually with my music okay. So i think you comfortable because, like you already know like bro, if i wanted to yeah no, that's like real [ __ ] like it's just right now, let me be an artist and let me do the groundwork and let me show y'all why, like as a Hairstylist when i was 16, i ain't gon na lie. It was hard because i had so many older stylists like trying to compete with me argue with me, beef with me putting a business card in the front of my shop, like you know, creating a beef in me being so young, i'm ready to get [ __ ] cracking i'm ready to fight, i'm ready, you know, and people tell me like club. You can't do that just let it show in your work. So as an artist i want to. I don't i don't want sympathy, i don't want people, oh well. Let'S go! Listen to clever music because whatever he said, i want people to actually see like this [ __ ] is grinding. This [ __ ] is really hustling and he really deserves to be whatever he's trying to be. I [ __ ] with that, and i can. I can, i can actually um hear the growth, because i think you did an interview uh two years ago, maybe three years ago, and you were saying like that was one of the things that you was um working towards, and that was like not not really taking. What everybody say so personal or something like like being famous, i guess because i think that's hard like people understand like people are famous, they still regular people. So you say something to me that disrespectful, i'm still trying to, but you still got a little bit of snap being you think, so it sounds like you like: no they're not, but what's disrespect to you. What was this about anything i feel like is this respect? If you um, [, __ ], said anything [, __ ] is great. No, not saying it like that, like anything like like any time, i feel like something is out of context and it's like who the [ __ ]. Are you talking like that's when i feel disrespect like or like people be thinking they disrespecting me when they be like? Oh he she i'm sorry, i'm like that. I don't care about that because i know a lot of people looking at me or, like you know, looking at what i have going on a lot of people, don't know how to um. You know like how to cope with that yeah. So i don't. I don't be feeling disrespect with that. Okay, so what's what is something that, like? I guess it's my comment under your picture, some wild [, __ ]. Does that disrespect yeah um, and sometimes i really do be arguing back with them and it's just like and then i'll be having my boyfriend getting on me like what you're trying to do? What are you doing? Why are you arguing with them like block them? Facts like i'm just thinking so do you think you have a do you think it's hard to be like famous, because if you think, if you argue with someone in your comments i mean that's like i mean i will say being an influencer being in the limelight. Sometimes, having you know, like followers and stuff, i feel like a lot of people feel like you owe them something. A lot of people feel like you owe them validation like first of all, let me just say this. This is probably why you feel like i'm so humble i don't need validation to know like who i am and what i do. I don't need a crowd. I don't need a posse, i'm a one-man show like i know what i'm capable of and another thing a lot of these like rappers and people who have [ __ ] going on. They don't have no talent like meaning like outside of rapping, what the [ __ ] can you do like? Who don't have talent since you i'm? I don't know who, like i'm just saying like you know like it's like. What can you do about it? It'S? No! It'S serious, it's like what can you do outside of being an influencer or a rapper or whatever? What can you do? What what do you have to show for if the rapping is dead today or tomorrow? What can you do so? This is true, and i see the talent for sure. Let'S talk about this, though oh my god for real bro. Listen, you don't work with people mm-hmm, you don't work with people before people became who they were before. People came people mm-hmm and you i hear you say you self-made you you doing all you. You did everything by yourself and it's other people that might have got cosigns and that helped their career but you're in a position where you can get a cosign from a couple people. I don't want a ghost line. I don't want people to look at me and say: oh only reason why he on is because i don't want that so because i feel like you don't last long like that. Oh hold up anybody just say that on this platform, let me challenge you respectfully. Yeah. Take your sip respectfully we got some [ __ ], that's giving grammys on instagram like we didn't sing, drake, post kodak, black and color black is still probably one of the hottest [ __ ] out right now we didn't seen people like you know like just and Don'T worry, i feel like instagram and social media isn't as authentic as he was in 2015 2016.. I feel like now. You got the actual fans, thinking that they're [ __, ] celebrities and they're just talking out the side of their asses and stuff, and it's just like back in the day you can post somebody business and they can blow up. Now you got ta post that person 10 times for them to even get 100 followers yeah, it's not like that yeah. So i just i'd rather just work. You know, and i'd rather like i've always been the type of person like. I rather show you better than i can tell you like, even being young. I remember in delaware, like i would be like about to catch the bus to go to work to do whatever i was doing, maybe if it was hair or journeys or whatever, and i remember like women like. Oh, you do hair and i'm like mm-hmm and everybody. How old are you? I was like 16 that was like child, my nephew do it like and they would be like bill. Don'T even know yeah, like you really don't know like [ __ ], i will slay the [ __ ] out your hair like, but i've always been the type of person. I'D rather show you than i can tell you. So we back and forth, like we said right, we're going music hair all this right question. Why do so many ladies um cause? I just interviewed two girls. They got something called beyond the cheer podcast shout out to him dope, but it's like everybody that gets in that position is like they get to a point where they super lit and they, like i ain't doing it, no more like why it's like you just it's So much it like. Oh my god, let me tell you as a hairstylist like once i moved to atlanta life started to hit me as far as like social media. As far as like cloud chasers um. At one point i was known as the biggest scammer at one point i was known for nothing too. I wasn't [ __ ] finessing, all right. No, i promise you i'm i'm literally a natural giver. I promise you this, like. I never have had to finesse. You know it might even be dead. Is okay, i'm gon na keep it real with you. I used to charge like four or five hundred dollars for installs. I have to finesse for nothing. Okay, my bad my bad, but um like let's just say. Like i remember on my 19th birthday, i did a hairstyle and i was selling hair and i remember in three hours i had me like 20 27, 000 right damn and the platform who was accepting the payments. They locked my money up for months and they weren't really telling me like. Oh well, we'll release it this day or whatever. So i remember like not really knowing what to do with people's orders, and i don't know if people thought i was going to spend my own money to. You know order the hair and ship it to them and then have you know basically make a long story. Short being so young like i, i didn't really have the guidance. You know what i'm saying and you know for a while. I was being looked at as a scammer or people would come to the salon and like try to pick with me, knowing i'm a snap out - and i don't know i just a lot of that type of stuff it just really like. I feel like my piece means more than anything so as a hair stylist, when you have to deal with these things, it's just like [, __ ], no, damn yeah like because like on the outside, i would see like yo like when, like i got, we got Somebody from baltimore that's super, lit up, doing, hair um and i remember like when she was like she had. She was quitting in the chat, i'm like what the [ __ ]. You just got super lit and i was just like. I don't understand - and i hear these girls that i had on the podcast they like beyond the chair and it's like bro, like you hear that so often from hairstylist right they just trying to get past that yeah um i mean, but i i never. The goal was to never be behind a chair for the rest of my life. I mean what the hell i started when i was 15, so it was only as you know, amount of time that, like the goal is to be rich, i'm talking rich rich. So it's only but so rich you can get behind the chair. Like you know, now you got you, you said you was like worth a couple mil. Did you ever see a million like i did all together? Yes, damn yeah did it because i mean you know and when i get signed, i'm going to definitely see more millions, you trying to get science yeah, i'm trying to get signed. I'M tired of spending my own money. I don't want to spend my own money. I want to spend your money. I don't want to spend my own money, it's just alone, but as a label, when you get signed to a label, they can do so much for you. They can get you all types of endorsements and brand deals and you're here. You'Re there you're on this billboard you're there. You have this feature with this art like i'd rather be signed. Yeah. I think i don't know, i'm a guy just think about it. If i'm signed - and i still have everything i have going on like with my vendors list - and you know - selling hair whatever i would be like a-okay, that means i mean. I think you ain't okay. Now i'm like no, but i wasn't a-a-a, okay, yeah yo. Do you do uh derby at all? No, you never did derpy. I just fight, that's [ __ ]. How was it [ __ ]? First of all, cuz, like i remember i had this girl working for me right, like therapists, they'd, be like they'd, be trying to like diagnose you with [ __ ] right. So i remember i had this girl and she had it there. She was my assistant and she used to have a therapist right and she used to act a little white. Sometimes her name was kayla and um. We would be like working and [ __ ] and, like let's say, if i yell at her, she would be like god i have to take my depressant medicine, and i just remember one day i turn around. I was like [ __ ], like that all that [ __ ] is fake as [ __ ], like you, don't even need no medicine, [ __ ] like stop playing with me right. So i remember she just stopped taking a medicine and everything was still fine. Like and i just feel like they're - i don't know i just like it's all a waste of money like i could talk to my boyfriend or my mom or somebody. You know who ain't gon na judge me interesting, because therapists be being messy too. You think so. Maybe going home telling their kids hell yeah if i was a therapist, i would that's because you ain't [, __ ], because you ain't don't mean this girl. Today she was telling me all these men. Like you know, i that's just what i would do. Let me tell you about this: [ __ ] man. What'S your name like, let's be real, you don't you don't think therapists go home and tell their family like was like.